Architecture for Kids podcast: Teach Process, Not Answers: Architecture As A Mindset with Pantéa Eslami and Hooman Talebi

What happens when you stop chasing the “right answer” and start teaching the art of the question? We sit down with architect‑educators Pantéa Eslami and Hooman Talebi to explore how architectural thinking can transform how children learn, create, and collaborate—without trying to turn them into architects.

Pantéa and Hooman share the origins of Archikid World, an educational platform that blends art, maths, storytelling, fabrication, and urban thinking. From carefully structured observation exercises to playful fabrication labs, they reveal how to design workshops that lower fear, invite safe failure, and build the soft skills schools often miss. Their cross‑disciplinary briefs ask kids to study animal anatomy, build clay characters, design spatial habitats, and film stop‑motion stories—teaching proportion, scale, perspective, and systems thinking along the way.

We gained insight into their partnerships with the Toronto District School Board and the World Urban Pavilion in Regent Park, where Archikid connects classroom goals to real‑world contexts and the Sustainable Development Goals, especially SDG 11 on sustainable cities. The conversation is candid about challenges: each brief can take 100–150 hours to craft, making repetition and new models essential. Their answer is to design beautiful educational playsets that marry aesthetics with learning, bringing spatial reasoning and design literacy into homes and classrooms.

If you care about critical thinking, creativity, and making learning feel alive, this story shows how architecture can be a mindset—process over perfection, curiosity over certainty, and purpose discovered through making. Subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a review to help more educators and parents find the show. What would you change first about the school curriculum?

Transcript

Host Intro And Partnerships

SPEAKER_00 0:09

Hello and welcome to another episode of Architecture for Kids podcast. I'm your host, Antonio Caplan. I'm a trained architect, an architectural educator, and founding director of award-winning Architecture for Kids CIC. In this podcast, I'm going to talk to practitioners and creatives that share the same passion as I do to inspire and to engage children and young people to shape their built environment and the creative industries. The podcast is brought to you in collaboration with the Built Environment Trust, the Thornton Education Trust, and the Welsh School of Architecture, Cardiff University.

Guests’ Backgrounds And Achievements

SPEAKER_00 0:53

My guests today are Pentizlami and Humani Talebi. Panti Islami is the co-founder of ARSH4D Studio, an internationally acclaimed Iranian architectural firm. The firm's achievements include being a finalist for the Aga Khan Award in 2010, as well as being shortlisted in the World Architecture Festival in 2011, 2017, and 2022. In 2016, she established Archikid World, an innovative educational platform where architecture serves as a tool to design cross-disciplinary workshops where children and youth engage in accurate observation, critical questioning, experiential learning, and creativity. An advocate for the arts and education, she serves as the curator of public art events. Humanita Labby is an architect and educator. He is the founder of award-winning practice Mars Design and Architecture. He currently serves as the course leader of SPIN Program BA at University of Kent and visiting lecturer at the Contemporary Architects Association in Iran, where he was the academic director between 2016 and 2019. Additionally, he is the creative director at ArchKid World and has co-directed international architecture workshops in countries such as Costa Rica and Romania. Pantia and Ruman have organized over 300 in-person workshops and more than 20 public events in both Canada and Iran. Since 2020, they have forged a meaningful partnership with Toronto District School Board, delivering in-school workshops to Toronto's public schools. Their workshops aim to provide students with a deeper understanding by integrating various subjects and connecting them to the real world. Pantia Numan, thank you for your time to talk to me today, and I'm looking forward to our conversation.

SPEAKER_02 2:52

Hi Antonio, thanks a lot for having us here. It's a great opportunity to be here with like-minded people and uh talk to you through this podcast and get connected to others as well.

SPEAKER_01 3:03

I would also like to say thank you, Antonio, for inviting us to the basic podcast.

SPEAKER_00 3:08

One of the first questions I'd like to ask you is what was your favorite subject at school and what subjects were you good at school if

Early School Influences And Mentors

SPEAKER_00 3:16

they were different?

SPEAKER_02 3:16

It's a good question for me because it's really deeply rooted to what I'm doing right now. During my childhood education, I was deeply drawn to math and geometry, and my passion for art as well was on the other hand. I remembered immense joy in solving geometry problems on the blackboard using colorful chalks to bring this concept to life. To be honest, it wasn't so much about teaching, but more about my love for problem solving, especially when it came to geometry. So this combination of mathematical curiosity and artistic expression fooled my interest in visualizing and understanding spatial designs. Because of my proficiency in both math and art, so many people saw me as a natural speed for architecture at that moment, even from a young age. And I found myself constantly drawing imaging space and design. And it became clear to me early on that age that architecture was where my passion truly lay the combination of mathematical precision uh with the freedom of artistic expression. Surprisingly, what university years brought a different perspective for me, and I can say unfortunately. While I expected my studies to seamlessly merge with math and art within architecture, I found myself challenged to preach these two words that in the major I pursued. And I can truly say, besides sketching and presentation, I was not able to find room for the artistic expression that I was expecting. And later on, this divergence from my expectations became a pivotal point in shaping my approach and understanding of the field. This gap, as I said, draw me to a crossroad where I felt that I have to choose between pursuing architecture or embarrassing my passion as an artist. So these two paths seem very demanding in full-time commitment. It was a challenging decision to navigate between the structured world of architecture and the free-flowing realm of art. And um, of course, I chose architecture since I've had been several years to educate myself and profoundly I was intending to seek more.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

As for me, it was a bit of a mix. I was decent in most subjects, but I can't really say I had a particular favorite. But what I really enjoyed were those morning and lunch breaks. In general, I was quite quiet in the class, enjoyed listening and learning. But what was really eager about was having those breaks where I would sprint out of class ready for some basketball, football, or any chance to move around and have some physical activity, washing off those sitting hours of the classroom. What really made the school memorable for me weren't the subject, it was mostly about the teachers, the teachers who fueled my passion. I would say the first teacher who did really create that passion in me was my Persian literature teacher, who was a bit of a rebel. So I was about 15, and he made literature for me and other classmates a vibrant subject. So instead of the usual classics, we wrote stories, which was a very interesting experience for us. Stories about our everyday experiences, finding beauty in the ordinary. So his unconventional approach for us was like living in a scene from Death Poet's Society that ironically he got fired just like John Keating in the movie. But he had very, very deep impact on me and my other classmates. We still talk about him. So later, music became a lifeline for me, and all thanks to another inspiring teacher. So again, this was about teachers and how they used to teach and make the subjects that they used to teach an inspiring subject. So music classes were banned during cultural changes that happened after the revolution. So I started the school three years after the revolution in Iran, and music was banned. But my parents insisted on music for my development, and I'm genuinely grateful for what they did. So I secretly took these private lessons. This music room at my teacher's house was a haven. We were surrounded by LPs, cassette records, music sheets. Those hours with him and his son, who became a very close friend of mine, truly transformed me. And then it was university. University brought its own disappointment. I chose architecture thinking I would lend my interest in art and science. But six years of engineering buildings wasn't really my kind of thing. But the turning point was when I met Bahrain Shirdin, my first mentor in architecture. He's a very progressive figure, one of the members of architects who transformed the discourse of architecture in the late 80s and 90s, amongst Peter Eisen. He's less known but quite influential. It all started with me interviewing him while I was working for this quarterly architecture magazine in Iran, running a section dedicated to young architects, students. And then he offered me to join the office with uh, so he asked me to go and find nine more young enthusiasts uh about architecture. And it was really being in that space. His office was at the Flex apartment, which showcased the unique lifestyle he had. So he lived in on the top floor and the office was below. And once again, I found myself immersed in the life and of an architect who's genuinely passionate about discipline. So when I started teaching, it was all about that. It was about sharing my passion. Officially, I took the role of teaching at the age of 18 when I started taking on piano students. But thinking about this, and I recently discovered that my teaching was really started when I started recording tapes for my classmates when I was about 15, trying to curate and prepare music tapes based on their interests to share my passion for classical.

SPEAKER_00 8:50

The next question was how supported you were in your career choices. And I think, Omar, it seems like it was all your teachers that really supported and inspired you. What about you, Pantya? How did that work for you?

Finding Identity In Art And Architecture

SPEAKER_00 9:02

A woman architect is a difficult thing, or was a difficult thing perhaps, especially in Iran. How does that work for you in terms of support in your choices?

SPEAKER_02 9:12

Actually, as I mentioned, uh for me, the beginning years of pursuing architecture as a major in university was, I can say, unsuccessful moment. I was one of those persons who would like to study more and more. I mean, I can say I was interested in everything, but then because it didn't meet my expectation, so I was not able to make connections between what I was expecting and imagining. It was continued like that. And then I was thinking that I was an artist because I used to paint since the very early age. And the professor that I had, I think the very first ones during the 10 years of my childhood experience were the ones that they were always using the materials which were surrounding us for inspiring. For example, whatever was in around us, we were using to draw. And then at some point I was so exhausted. I was really good in skills, but I was not able to be myself even in drawing or in painting. It was at the age of 20 that I met an artist who was inspiring for me through all my life, who was named Aidela Shahi. She was an abstract artist. And once we met, she told me that you are an artist, you are an architect, but you don't know who you are. Your job is to seek for your identity. And that was the moment that I realized that I have to look for something for myself, nothing which has been written for the other ones. And that was the moment that I suffered more during the university years, and um I started to self-educate myself.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

You have your own different practices, and you also in different parts of the world, but you work together, and I suppose what brings you together is the work with children and young people.

Origin Story Of Archikid World

SPEAKER_00 11:09

Tell us a little bit about that working relationship you have. How did that come about?

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Homan, do you want me to start? I I think you should start with the story of Arcikid because Archikid is where we actually met, the reason we met and we started working.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

Yeah, maybe I'm gonna just give you a story of how the Archikid started working. The beginning of Archikid traces back to some pivotal moments in my life, the childhood experiences, lacking proper training in basic soft skills, and the lack of the vision of cross-disciplinary thinking during my university years. But however, it was the transformative experience of becoming a model that provided a fresh perspective and prompting me to retrace my educational path and comfort the gaps I've had faced. And then the exception of Architecade coincide with my daughters reaching at the age of six and the weekend at our office alongside supportive colleagues and became the catalyst for this innovative venture. For the first time, I felt that the convergence of different disciplines, especially in architecture and the visual arts, that had always captivated me in making architecture contents was for me. So it was an organic environment. I was experiencing everything in the first year by myself and the way that I wanted to experience. So I was uh particularly focused on nurturing essential soft skills in children like observation, self-expression, teamwork, giving them the courage to make mistakes and fail, and more importantly, experience because these were the things that I was not able to experience when I was a child. And I didn't want my daughter to be like that. So that was the initial point of the beginning working with archetypes. So I recalled a workshop which started with an exercise to encourage the children for observation, asking them to visualize the sky of the city that they have in their mind. And then I invited them to sketch from sky to the rooftop skyline. And their interpretations were totally diverse, reflecting their unique background. Some depicted blue skies with birds, while others showcased a harsher reality with polluted gray skies, especially the kids who were living in Tehran. This, their skylight drawings were equally varied, revealing satellite signals or table lines. It was a testimony of individual context and perception. And the kids, they were all surprised as well. That was the first day of running the program, but at that point I was invited by the director of organization Iran, which is named Contemporary Architect Association, who's where Human was the academic director of the architectural program over there. So I was invited to collaborate with them to have the architect workshops over there. And that was the time that I first met Human and we were started collaborating. And to be honest with you, I was passionate about architecture, about art and kids. But then after the first year of my experience, everything was developing organically. It was not in a, I can say, the academic setting, and then Human was professional in that. It was a turning point for Archie Kid to meet him and later on having him in our board.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

As Pantal said, the first time I learned about Archikid was while I was directing her the Contemporary Architecture Association in Iran. So we were introduced by actually the founder of the institute, Elham Azavi, an amazing lady, really forward-thinking, who introduced us. This institute is an independent educational institute that's tried to promote more progressive architecture. And we thought I was quite impressed by uh Panta's vision. I found it quite inspirational. So I thought I would start contributing to shape a more robust educational structure for Archikit. During that period, which took about a year or two, we planned over 20 briefs and we engaged students at different parts of the school, including our Fab Lab. That was a great experience for us. I guess in the Fab Lab, we ran fabrication workshops for kids aged 7 to 12 and they could customize their own playthings. We designed some basic interlocking components with adjustable arms and flexible joints, which allowed them to mold their own shapes and then later on they laser cut their own designs and start building the stuff that they were interested in building. But the real focus for us was developing these cross-disciplinary courses. I think one of the most notable examples is

Cross‑Disciplinary Workshop Design

SPEAKER_01 15:25

our first summer course, which was a crossplay between illustration, filmmaking, storytelling, sculpture, architecture, and the city. The participants studied different animals. And so we encourage them to better understand their anatomy, their movement, their sight, the body proportions. And then based on that, they develop their own characters. They select a certain animal, try to understand that, then build a cartoonish figure made out of clay based on that animal. And then we start using that character, allowing them to start thinking about the space. So we asked them to design the space for the house of that particular animal, thinking about the proportion of a giraffe when you think about the space, how that changes all the fundamentals of architecture. If you think about an alligator, the location of the eyes, how close they are to the ground, allowed us to make them rethink about very basic things that you might not think of when you start thinking about architecture. Based on those, we asked them to develop some stories happening inside within those spaces. Then later on, they brought those creatures into life by stop motions and filmmaking. So it was a very exciting experience for us for the first time, merging all these different disciplines. And it became a basis of what a lot of things that we did afterwards. So we collaborated with choreographers, chefs, illustrators, filmmakers, botanists. But at the core of all these experiments was space and architecture. And then the pandemic hit. It was a big turning point for us. I was in the UK, Huntel was in Canada when the lockdown started. But drawing from my six years' experience of living between Iran and the UK, I thought it was an easy transition for me because I used to do that with my office, with my kids. I used to play with my daughter, her carrying the iPad on WhatsApp around the house. So it was a smooth and swift transition to online teaching, which allowed us to expand rapidly. We immediately formed partnerships globally and of course faced some new challenges. So we had to immediately adapt our teaching materials to local needs and then develop teaching materials, guidelines for people who used to work with us. I also started seeking new collaborations. So one of them was collaboration with Mariam Logger, a BAFTA winner of Short Animation, who joined us and we developed a course which was again interconnected storytelling, character development, movie making, sound effect literature. And then we combined that with mathematical, logic, and set theory principles, which was turned into very simple, easy accessible topics. We used this model again and again throughout the years, but unfortunately, it wasn't a very sustainable financial model. We found it more and more increasingly difficult to continue with that model.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

In your programs, is there a relationship to the curriculums or is it more creative and free expression, what you do?

SPEAKER_02 18:17

That's a good question because the first that we start working with kids, so everyone is imagining that kids are creative by the nurture. But then the first exercise, we provided very open, unlimited exercises for the kids. What we confront was that they were not able to express themselves because they were shocked. There was some sort of a fear that they have faced, and then they were not able to express themselves. And some of them they start to cry. And it was at that moment that we understand that we have to design our exercises in a way that it has to have some sort of a structure, and within that structure will let them to play and to experience. And later on, we understand that every exercise that we design is like a play that we are designing. So that kind of play led them to experience failure, and then they can easily go back and forth. That's the way that we are doing

Pandemic Shift And Global Expansion

SPEAKER_02 19:12

that. But in terms of the curriculum that you were mentioning, the national curriculum in the educational system. So what we are doing is that we categorize our workshop content-wise into several thematic areas. So we have archivart, so archimat, archivody, which is we can just call it body texture or archy social cultural, architecture, fabrication, and archive food, and they are open to the other more. But each tent encapsulated a unique facet of architecture, interwing with various disciplines. But while the core principle resonates across all workshops and their overlaps among above-mentioned categories, this categorization aimed to offer our audiences a clear understanding, facilitate their selection based on their Specific interest. For example, we have been partnered with TDSE Toronto District School Board from 2020 in Toronto to introduce in school workshops under these categories that I'm going to mention: Archimat, ArchieArt, Archie Socio Cultural, and Archie Green. The purpose of this partnership is to help students gain a better understanding of their curriculum and relate this concept to the real life scenarios. Let's imagine that TDSV is our client. The teachers of the schools, they're referring to us. For example, if it's a math teacher, she is saying that this is our budget and we want to make children understand or get a deeper understanding of, for example, this subject. It's a pattern. We design the content with the help of that educators and the teachers. And then after we implement that workshop with them. I think the most important part of our work is the collaboration and partnership with different organizations. So it depends on the organization, how we implement our methodology or let's say our approach into them. I can give you another example. So we since 2021, we have been selected as the Secretariat of Kids Awareness of World Urban Pavilion, which is an initiative in Region Park, Toronto, an initiative which has been made by Urban Economy Forum and UN Habitat. So we are focusing on SDGs, the sustainable development goals of UN and focusing on the SDG 11, sustainable cities, and providing the programs for the kids. The area of the focus now is shifting in another way. But the language that we are using and the tools that we are using is the same. So architecture

Curriculum Alignment And Thematic Tracks

SPEAKER_02 21:46

in space is what we have as a tool, and then we add another layer on top of it to make them more comprehensive and tangible for the children.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Omar talked a little bit about the challenges. And when you said that part of you trying to set up during the pandemic, it didn't really become financially viable. Do you want to talk a little bit about what are the challenges and the milestones or the enthusiasm that makes you go?

SPEAKER_01 22:13

Unfortunately, the majority of challenges are actually financial because throughout the years we have been subsidizing work in Arcikid by our offices. I think in average we spend about 150 hours of preparation amongst ourselves for every brief. Every workshop is the outcome of at least 100, 150 hours of work. And unless we repeat it many, many, many, many times, it doesn't become a very economically sustainable model. But what we have been working on recently is, and we are actually quite excited about it, is to turn material into educational packages because it's where we actually can really marry our passion about education and design. So we are working on designing. We have been spending hours and hours, months and months on developing new playsets, beautifully crafted, because we realize at the moment in the market, most toys they lack any design. They are engineered, but they are not beautiful. And we believe a piece of the toy can be as inspiring, as educational, just the look of it, the aesthetics of it, as a piece of sculpture or a beautiful painting. This is what we have been working on, and we are quite optimistic about the future of it.

SPEAKER_00 23:25

In your view, what is the impact, the work you are doing with the kids and with the built environment?

SPEAKER_02 23:31

Maybe it's the best time to mention what are the formats of our educational packages, because that might help to see what are the impact. Our programs are offered in two seemingly different formats. So one involves continuous sessions, like typically offered in packages of two, four, or eight sessions tailored based on clients' budgets and demand. Often the organization like our collaborators, such as TDSE, they ask us for those. If we're not thinking that the more consistent these programs are, the more impactful they become for the students. For instance, one of our primary objectives is to introduce children to cross-disciplinary thinking, creating them with the tools to use their skills and knowledge for specific projects, regardless of the project's nature. I think this approach deeply resonates with my daughter who grew up under this vision. I can remember that after participating in various workshops after I think a year, she had a project at school where I witnessed her innovative approach firsthand. I was passing by her room, I observed her drawing something on a piece of paper, folding it and taping it to the table. Then she used her iPod, creating a makeshift filter with the tape for the camera, and began filming from within the structure she built. I asked her about her activity. She explained that her social science teacher requested a painting to represent a specific project. However, she decided to elevate it by crafting a 3D model with a scenario and filming it to convey her intentions in greater detail to the teacher. Her capacity to be able in translating a simple task into a multidimensional and interactive representation amazed me. I think it was a level of creativity and problem solving that I couldn't have imagined even when I was at the age of 20, unfortunately. I just gave this example to see how we were expecting to see the impactfulness of these continuous programs. But then we have another format for our educational packages, which is that event. This could be in either private or public. In this event format,

Sustainability Challenges And Product Vision

SPEAKER_02 25:42

our primary goal is totally different. Our goal is to raise awareness within specific groups or communities. These events are structured as drop-in sessions and strategically designed to captivate the audience's attention and foster active engagement within the subject matter. When designing the content for this event, we consider several factors. We initiate the process with individual activities and then gradually transition into group board. So one of the highlights was the event Igbo Aferdos back in Tehran about five years ago. So which was a public event where we were engaged in two different aspects of launching a citywide event, one as the curator of the whole event, one as one of the group among 16 groups of artists from various fields. So whose conservative use their art as a medium to get connected to the people and make connections between the people as well. And then we were the observer of the unity of the people from different uh socioeconomical backgrounds. And um, they were all actively engaged in the event and participating in the collaborative process of doing collective and art activity. Our aim and goal was to make the community at that time.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

One other question is what is it for you that you get doing this work with Jules? Why do you do it?

SPEAKER_01 26:58

As I said, the first thing for me, I I I don't know what's the root of it, but I enjoy sharing my passion. So that's really the first thing. And it has been with me since, as I said, since I was 15. It also quite inspirational when I try to structure myself in order to be able to explain things. It always those moments of revelation. Because once you start thinking about things in the more simplified terms, you start thinking about the basic of things and asking yourself very fundamental questions. So it has always helped me to think about fundamentals and also structure myself, which is very inspirational.

SPEAKER_02 27:32

For me, I can say that Archikit serves as a dynamic environment that cultivates learning and sharing and ongoing development for me. And I think for all the participants, like all the educators and learners, that they are involved in it. But then it was a transformative journey which turned individual, my individual words into active learner. I can say that my architectural world has been changed during these years because I can see differently what is happening around me, and I learn how to get inspired from every moment and every scene that is surrounding me. That's why, despite all the financial problems that we are facing in Tehran, in Toronto, and I myself don't

Measuring Impact: Programs And Events

SPEAKER_02 28:21

want to abandon it. And I think it's a project for me to promote myself and to learn more with the help of Archikit.

SPEAKER_00 28:29

One last question. Is there a question I should have asked you that I haven't asked you? And what is that question?

SPEAKER_01 28:34

I have a question, which I don't have any answer to it, but I would like to share it with you and with everyone. Because since I've taken the new role as a director of SPIN program in the University of Kent, and I'm dealing more and more with young students coming from high school, it surprised me how difficult they found it to think outside the box. It seems the educational system trained them to think about purpose and do every decision purposefully. While we know that creation and art is not necessarily related to purpose, really. You create the purpose. So it's it's a big question, as I think a very fundamental question, as how we can help young kids who are entering the world be equipped with that mode of thinking, that mindset that allows them not to think about purpose for designing this or that, but think about a more innovative outside the box. It's just been in my mind since I started this new role.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

Absolutely, I agree with you, but I think it's it's to do with critical thinking. It's to do with kids are being taught to have an answer. And then they come to design school or architecture school and they can't think critically. They just expect there's an answer. And when you say to them, it's not about an answer, it's about a process. And anything is possible depending on how you think about it and how you put it together, they just find it really, really hard. I mean, I teach first years as well in architecture. Every week there's a student crying because they came to university with three A's and they don't understand why they're struggling so much, and they can't understand why isn't there an answer. Well, the answer you created yourself. I think the work you were doing, making kids understand about critical thinking and processes are extremely, extremely important, you know, to be prepared for future careers and university studies and so on and so forth. I really like your question.

SPEAKER_01 30:24

It's a very valid point. I completely agree with you. I sincerely hope that what we are doing, which is because this is what which is what our goal is, to encourage critical thinking to make hits, to think about questions. And that's part of critical thinking. When you are a critical thinker, you think about question more than the answer, because that's what really leads you to the answers. So it's it's as important, if not more important, to think about the question. And I completely agree with you.

SPEAKER_00 30:48

It's but I think that's to do with the curriculum, and I think the curriculum needs to change. A lot is being taught in primary and secondary school is totally useless. It doesn't serve you for your career, there's doesn't give you soft skills, doesn't really offer you problem solving, analytical thinking. It's it's a huge problem. Pantya, and you is that a question I should have asked you?

SPEAKER_02 31:09

No, no, it's not a question, but when Uman was talking, I was thinking that we have to mention that why we believe that architectural way of thinking

Why We Teach: Passion And Purpose

SPEAKER_02 31:17

is a good approach for kids because it's under the umbrella of critical thinking, it's a process-based. Everything I think that the kids need to get in their educational process, it lays on the architectural way of thinking. And that's why we believe it's a good tool if we know how to use it. That's why we believe that we don't want to raise another generation of little architects. And what we are doing is just using architecture as a tool, which is a good educational tool in this matter.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

Absolutely. I think through learning through design I'd be a much more interesting and rounded teaching and learning uh system. Thank you for coming to talk to me today. Felt really inspired by our conversation and the work you did.

SPEAKER_01 31:58

Thank you, Antonio, for having us today. It was a very joyful conversation.

SPEAKER_02 32:02

I also wanted to thank you, and it was a pleasure just to go through and review all those years, which was the basic lines of uh initiating this platform.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

Thank you very much to my guests today, to all the listeners, and please subscribe to Architecture for Kids Podcast and leave your rating and the review. Recommend us to your friends and family, and to find out more about it, visit our websites AntonioCaplan.co dot uk, buildingcenter.co.uk, Thornton Education Trust.org, Cardiff.ac.uk and follow us on Instagram archforkidscic, Twitter and Kaplun, LinkedIn and Kaplun, C A P E L A O, and please join me again next week for another episode of Architecture for Kids Podcast, brought to you in collaboration with the Built Environment Trust, the Thornton Education Trust, and the Welsh School of Architecture, Cardiff University.